How business success aligns with diversity equity and inclusion
[Music]
you know it’s it’s
fascinating to think that our our
workplace and our approach to dei
largely hasn’t changed following
about immediately post world war ii but
then you look at who our workforce is
now it’s 47
female and 49 of
millennial workers who make up the
biggest share of the workforce
are people of color and so if you’re not
hearing from those people
you are leaving an immense amount of
good ideas on the table
and you’re just leaving money on the
table and so
you know in just an increasingly
competitive environment
that’s how you get your competitive
advantage i mean they’re already there
you’ve already done the work to bring
them to the workplace
and so you know it can be that you’re
looking at that from
a product design lens that you just want
to create products
that appeal to a wider audience
it can be that you’re looking at this
from a risk mitigation perspective
you know we’re seeing that organizations
that have more diverse leadership
bounce back more quickly following
recessions and you know yeah we see from
an innovation lens it’s really cool to
see
tech companies that employ more
inclusive strategies
end up producing more patents so they
just
end up creating more and it has a bigger
impact on who their consumer base is you
know and how they’re perceived how other
people perceive their brand
yeah this just sounds like a win all
around to make forward progress
to recognize for companies that are at
the starting line that that’s in fact
where they are
and that there’s a lot of distance that
can be traveled
from there in your ted talk you
described
the uh you know the destination point of
true gender equity being reached in a
distant future
are there companies that are moving that
um
that finish line or that new state line
closer faster than others and are there
any examples of those that are actually
close you know in near term now given
the value and benefits
of gender equity
patagonia we really look at patagonia as
a great leader in this space
um they’ve always been a player that
just says okay show us the research
on what is going to be the best for our
underrepresented employees and we’ll do
that thing
and so you know they were kind of one of
the first to do that with pain leave
they’ve had great flex work policies and
it shows so they report just
having close to zero attrition of their
employees
they’re just not losing anyone because
people are happy and they want to stay
um salesforce mark benioff has
done i want to say he’s not just done a
lot of work he’s been very vocal about
the work they’re doing
in a way that goes beyond pr um so we
really look to them as a leader as well
where you know he’s he’s talked about
this publicly
that he realized one day they’ve never
done a true pay gap audit in their
company
they did one they found gaps and then he
just said we’ll close that
like pay the people more do it he went
completely public about this and told
everyone we have pay gaps
instead of doing this like hush keep it
behind the scenes
so he set a great example for other
businesses
and then you know the next step he took
that we really find to be the most
important
is that then he said let’s look at the
systemic factors that caused this pay
gap in the first place
which you know is what we really look to
leaders to do that people do these pay
gap analyses and they treat them like
pay gaps happen in a vacuum
and so then they will pay the employees
who were making less the speaking of
broad strokes
you know they’ll pay them to close that
gap and it’s a short-term
fix and so we say yeah that’s great go
and close this gap because those people
deserve to be paid more
but in three years you’re gonna have a
pay gap again you know that problem is
gonna come right back and it’s gonna
resurface
so you know it’s just a symptom of
something else that’s really underlying
and then you know locally in seattle um
evia events
is one of our our recently certified
organizations
um you’re familiar with them i think
they actually did some production work
with ted
um they are doing great work in this
space especially just because they
center it
on such a consistent basis that you know
yes they put these policies in place
like they do blind resume reviews now
they standardize their performance
evaluation practices
um they’ve really structured their
mentorship so that everyone is equal
access to senior leaders
and then you know from what i see in
their blogs and what i hear from their
employees
it’s like they talk about equity and
inclusion every week you know
it’s not just something where like they
give water bottles to women on
international women’s day and make a
statement that they care
they really do put in the work and it’s
shown
in their products that they offer that
you know they’re more inclusive in terms
of
multiple languages being offered in
their captions
for you know the digital products that
they provide
and really they design everything they
do with an equity lens so that’s super
cool to see
um and then yeah i just i look at you
know
it’s hard not to just focus on
organizations that we certify but nia
impact capital
is another great one they were our first
one and they
are an impact investment firm and so the
interesting thing about them is that
they started
i mean they were founded with a gender
lens their founder
said let’s have a you know gender
forward investment portfolio so it’s the
thing that they cared about
and they still found that they had a lot
of work to do
you know when we assessed them you know
it was this great moment for them where
i mean they literally were created to
further
the purpose of gender equity and they
still
found when it came to evaluating their
own practices and processes that they
had changes to make
and you know similar to mark benioff
they were very public about them
they said these are what our gaps were
and this is what we did to change them
and you know i don’t think they’ve lost
an employee since
you know i think employees are there and
engaged and just have this sense of
pride
in what they do and
you know it almost sounds like a drive
towards business
success is a great dni de ni
driver right i mean everything you’re
mentioning are specific
uh research-based practical
they each and collectively show positive
business results
um and employee satisfaction improvement
results
um so it sounds like it’s
you know all just across the board
beneficial for companies and
um producing powerful results at at all
levels
um taking it back to the uh
you know the the fact that there is this
mix of unconscious bias plus uh
organizational inertia and historical
system systemic dynamics in place
there there may be some programs that um
that make claims to do a
significant significant um change in de
ni
but only kind of really scratched the
surface
how can a company distinguish between
a something that sort of is a a band-aid
on something that needs some more
significant overhaul
that’s a great question so we
you know whether or not you’re you’re
going to end up working with jen
we say you know if you’re an employer an
employee a consumer who wants to spend
money in alignment with your values
ask what the criteria are behind
you know whether they’re a consultancy
or a non-profit organization or a best
workplaces
to work list ask what the criteria are
ask what they’re measuring
um what gets measured matters you know
and it ends up driving the focus in an
organization
so if an outside consultancy comes in
and says
you just need to focus on representation
that’s a problem
if that is their only set of criteria
because you know if you’re a giant
organization like amazon you can
afford to essentially rehire and rehire
and rehire so representation numbers
look
great but they may be bringing people
into the organization
that they’re not really ready to include
you know where they’ve
put up new window dressing but they
haven’t fixed the house and so
you know we put all of our criteria
online for a reason
you know we kind of joke that we test
let it like we put it out there and we
say even if you don’t work with us feel
free to use these
design your organizations and be equity
centered but those are also meant to act
as a kind of checklist for people to
look at so that you know
if you’re interviewing for a job you
know
you can ask how have you standardized
your performance evaluation practices
how do you ensure
you know women and minorities get equal
access to professional development
opportunities here
and there are ways that they should and
shouldn’t be doing those things
um you know one of the
the things that we look at with a really
critical eye are
other lists because that’s why it’s why
we created what we’re doing
um and so frankly you know i sit
in conversation after conversation with
potential certification candidates
that say you know wow you have
actionable
insightful recommendations but we’d have
to do the work
and frankly we look at these guys over
here and we can write them a check for
ten thousand dollars
make a public statement that we’re
committed to equity and we’re good and
so
you know we’re sorry but we’re going
with that approach
and i understand why um
but it does make it so that those of us
who are you know working with
organizations to make authentic change
are up against even bigger barriers
you know and it makes it that much more
confusing for women and people of color
to assess
where they’re really going to be
appreciated you know and who’s going to
honor their ambitions so we just we ask
everyone look for criteria and if you
can’t find any that’s a red flag
you know if you can’t find any that
probably means that a consultancy went
in
and said yes you’re great you’re doing
everything right
you know you can check the box and tell
your employees they have nothing to
complain about
um and go on your way so if they don’t
have criteria that’s a problem
so it is critical that organizations
recognize
the necessity of actually doing some of
the work i’m struck by
how the way that work gets recognized
and even how it gets implemented can
look really differently
it can seem like an incredible amount of
work but when
at the end of the day it might come down
to things like
having an extra minute during a meeting
to give people a chance to respond
that’s the kind of work like it’s just
good for your relationship
work right it you know it may seem hard
at first
but once you do it you see the benefits
right away
you know improved interactivity improved
closeness improved
uh cross-pollination of ideas improved
engagement and improved energy is that
also true um more broadly do you think
that
organizations see the benefits in in
that kind of a light um does that help
become a motivator if it is
that helps them get over some of the
hurdles of the work
absolutely i mean i think
yeah there’s an inertia right there’s an
inertia to overcome
and i think what we see is once they
take the first step
they find out it’s not that bad like
it’s really
not the nightmare situation that a lot
of people envision
in fact it’s usually just really
positive and exciting
and employees are happy that it’s
finally happening and they’ve finally
been heard
you know it doesn’t turn into this place
where it’s like all the men are going to
lose their jobs
like that really is not the outcome it’s
that the people who are
there are finally being seen um
and so yeah i mean i think whether or
not it’s a motivator it’s something that
organizations
eventually experience and it’s probably
the most common piece of feedback we get
is just this isn’t what we thought it
was going to be
you know really grateful that we did it
um but it is that first step that’s
that’s the hardest it’s like lacing up
the running juice is the hardest part
right to be cliche
um and for a lot of them you know to be
completely honest they come to us
because they’ve had a discrimination
complaint or they’ve had something
bad happen that finally is kind of their
wake-up call
where they realize that you know they
really do
need to do something different and then
they find out that this really um is
about changing systems
you know they find out that it’s about
changing some processes
and a lot of them they’re just plug and
play it’s like
you change them once and you’re set to
go
so it’s really more efficient than doing
like
trainings every year and just trying to
be better people you know it’s just that
onus from the employee to the
organization in a way where we hope they
people don’t actually have to constantly
think
about whether or not they’re
incidentally being biased
because these processes should protect
against it even if they’re being biased
so in a way if we are
not consciously including we’re probably
unconsciously excluding
um we’re coming to the end of our
time together now i’m wondering if you
have any
closing thoughts or uh call to action or
final takeaway that you’d like to leave
us with perhaps a broad
statement that could apply to lots of
different people whether they’re
business leaders or employees
i like that um i mean the thing that you
just said is great you know
i think some of the feedback we hear a
lot of times that’s a little bit
sad people think you know okay well if
we have to bring in
you know a lot more underrepresented
people does that mean that we have to
lower our standards
which is an unfortunate way of thinking
about it and you know one of the things
i bring up like it’s not
that you’re necessarily you’re not
having to bring in anyone who’s not
qualified it’s that you’re finally
bringing in
everyone who’s qualified you know that
you’ve been
leaving people out unintentionally
by not including them via your processes
um you know i think just in the times
that we’re in
and i think this will will probably stay
true
um a lot of organizations and
in the wake of me too and now you know
as black lives matter really gains a lot
of momentum
organizations are revisiting their
diversity numbers for the first time in
years
and they’re finding out that they
haven’t budged you know and they’re
saying how did this happen
how could this be and you know
kind of two recommendations i would just
make for them
is this time around you have this
renewed energy and that is fantastic
don’t stop at a recruiting strategy you
know if an organization comes to us for
recruiting
i will insist that they need a retention
equity and inclusion strategy
because it’s not fair to bring
underrepresented people into
organizations that aren’t ready
for them um and the other one if i think
if there was like a slogan
like a drop on organizations it would
just be that dei
is not your company kickball team so
please get experts to work with you if
you don’t have anyone in-house we see
a lot of companies treat diversity
equity inclusion
like this fund extracurricular like
kickball where they’re like hey we’ve
decided to start a dei task force
you know whoever is interested show off
wednesday with your best ideas
and you know would you do this with it
with accounting would you do this with
operations or any other business
critical function
um no so when we see companies do that
you know when they take the kickball
approach
this is what happens is a lot of
googling occurs
which leads to like your cached
algorithms bringing you to links that
make you feel comfortable
and then there’s a lot of infighting
about what people should do
and then everyone stares the one person
of color or woman in the room and says
well what do you think
um and that person’s in a really risky
position at that point
and they can bear you know a huge amount
of risk and being honest with people
so we really just asked organizations
please call an expert
ask what their criteria are to actually
help you
treat dei like any other critical
business function
and you’ll see huge success for both
social factors and financial
thank you sarah that is just wonderful
to see it
laid out and clearly expressed the way
you do uh
you know and here’s to a a near-term
future
and hopefully a broad-wide deep future
where everyone is deeply meaningfully
included in
every aspect of the work and we bring
everyone’s contributions
to bear against the business critical
functions that we all want to
deliver on sarah thank you so much um
really really appreciate you taking the
time chris thank you phil
i appreciate it