Battling bad science Ben Goldacre

so I’m a doctor but I kind of slipped

sideways into research and now I’m an

epidemiologist and nobody really knows

what epidemiology is epidemiology is the

science of how we know in the real world

if something is good for you or bad for

you and it’s best understood through

example as the science of those crazy

wacky newspaper headlines and these are

just some of the examples these are from

the Daily Mail every country in the

world has a newspaper like this it has

this kind of bizarre ongoing

philosophical project of dividing all

the objects in the world really into the

ones that either cause or prevent cancer

so here are some of the things they’ve

said cause cancer recently divorced

Wi-Fi toiletries and coffee here are

some of the things they say prevent

cancer crushed red-pepper licorice and

coffee so already you can see there are

contradictions here coffee both causes

and prevents cancer and as you start to

read on you can see that maybe there’s

some kind of political valence behind

some of this so for women housework

preventive rest cancer but for men

shopping could make you impotent so we

know that we need to start unpicking the

science behind this and what I hope to

show is that I’m picking dodgy claims

I’m picking the evidence behind dodgy

claims isn’t a kind of nasty carping

activity it’s socially useful but it’s

also a kind of an extremely valuable

explanatory tool because real science is

all about critically appraising the

evidence for somebody else’s position

that’s what happens in academic journals

that’s what happens and academic

conferences the Q&A session after a

postdoc presents data is often a

bloodbath and nobody minds that we

actively welcome it it’s like a kind of

consenting intellectual S&M activity so

what I’m going to show you is all of the

main themes all of the main features of

my discipline evidence-based medicine

and I will talk you through all of these

and demonstrate how they work

exclusively using examples of people

getting stuff wrong so we’ll start with

the absolute weakest form of evidence

known to man and that is Authority in

science

don’t care how many letters you have

after your name in science we want to

know what your reasons are for believing

something how do you know that something

is good for us or bad for us but we’re

also unimpressed by Authority because

it’s so easy to contrive this is

somebody called dr. Gillian McKeith PhD

would you give her full medical title

Gillian McKeith again every country has

somebody like this she is our TV diet

guru she has massive kind of five series

of primetime television giving out very

lavish and exotic health advice she

turns out has a non-accredited

correspondence course PhD from somewhere

in America she also boasts that she’s a

certified professional member of the

American Association of nutritional

consultants which sounds very glamorous

and exciting you get a certificate and

everything this one belongs to my dead

cat Hetty she was a horrible cat you

just go to the website fill out the form

give them $60 and arrives in the post

now that’s not the only reason that we

think this person is an idiot she also

goes on and says things like you should

eat lots of dark green leaves because

they contain lots of chlorophyll and

that will be oxygenate your blood and

anybody who’s done school biology

remembers that chlorophyll in

chloroplasts only makes oxygen in

sunlight and it’s quite dark in your

bowels after you’ve eaten spinach next

we need proper science proper evidence

so red wine can help prevent breast

cancer there’s a headline from The Daily

Telegraph in the UK a glass of red wine

a day could help prevent breast cancer

so you can find this paper and what you

find is it is a real piece of science

it’s a description of the changes in the

behavior of one enzyme when you drip a

chemical extracted from some red grape

skin onto some cancer cells in a dish on

a bench in a laboratory somewhere and

that’s a really useful thing to describe

in a scientific paper but on the

question of your own personal risk of

getting breast cancer if you drink red

wine it tells you absolutely bugger-all

okay actually turns out that your risk

of breast cancer actually increases

slightly with every amount of alcohol

that you drink so what we want is

studies in real human people and here’s

another example this is from Britain’s

leading diet and nutritionist in The

Daily Mirror which is our second biggest

selling newspaper an Australian study in

2001 found that olive oil in combination

with fruits vegetables and pulses offers

measurable protection against skin

wrinkling so then they give the advice

if you eat olive oil and vegetables

you’ll have fewer skin wrinkles and they

very helpfully tell you how to

paper so you go find the paper and what

you find is an observational study right

obviously nobody has ever been able to

go back to like 1930 get all of the

people born in one motor nity unit and

half of them eat lots of fruit and veg

and olive oil and then half of them eat

McDonald’s and then we see how many

wrinkles you’ve got later you have to

take a snapshot of how people are now

and what you find is of course people

are eat fruit and veg and olive oil have

fewer skin wrinkles but that’s because

people are eating fruit and veg in olive

oil they’re freaks okay they’re not

normal they’re like you they come to

events like this right

they are posh they’re wealthy they’re

less likely to have outdoor jobs they’re

less likely to do manual labour they

have better social support they’re less

like to smoke so for a whole host of

fascinating interlocking social

political and cultural reasons they are

less likely to have skin wrinkles that

doesn’t mean that it’s the vegetables or

the olive oil

so ideally what you want to do is a

trial and everybody thinks they’re very

familiar with the idea of a trial trials

are very old the first trials in the

Bible Daniel 1:12 it’s very

straightforward you take a bunch of

people you split them in half you treat

one group one way you treat the other

group the other way and then a little

while later you fold them up and see

what happened to each of them so I’m

going to tell you throughout about one

trial which is probably the most well

reported trial in the UK news media over

the past decade and this is trial of

fish oil pills and the claim was fish

oil pills improved school performance

and behavior in mainstream children and

they said we’ve done a trial all the

previous trials were positive and we

know this one’s going to be - that

should always ring alarm bells right

because if you’ve already know the

answer to your trial you shouldn’t be

doing one either you’ve rigged it by

design or you’ve got enough data so

there’s no need to randomize people

anymore so this is what they were going

to do in their trial they were taking

3,000 children they were going to give

them all these huge fish oil pills six

of them a day and then a year later they

were going to measure their school exam

performance and compare their exam

performance against what they predicted

their exam performance would have been

if they hadn’t had the pills

now can anybody spot a flaw in this

design and no professors of clinical

trial methodology are allowed to answer

this question so there’s no control okay

there’s no control great but that sounds

really techy right that sounds really no

that’s a technical term but the kids got

the pills and then their performance

improved what else could it possibly be

if it wasn’t the pills they got older

okay we all develop over time and of

course also there’s the placebo effect

recibo effect is one of those

fascinating things in the whole of

medicine it’s not just about taking a

pill and your performance and your pain

getting better

it’s about our beliefs and expectations

it’s about the cultural meaning of a

treatment and this has been demonstrated

in a whole raft of fascinating studies

comparing one kind of placebo against

another so we know for example that two

sugar pills a day are a more effective

treatment for getting rid of gastric

ulcers than one sugar pill a day two

sugar pills a day beats one sugar pill a

day and that’s an outrageous and

ridiculous finding but it’s true we know

from three different studies all three

different types of pain that a saltwater

injection is a more effective treatment

for pain than taking a sugar pill taking

a dummy pill that has no medicine in it

not because the injection or the pill do

anything physically to the body but

because an injection feels like a much

more dramatic intervention so we know

that our beliefs and expectations can be

manipulated which is why we do trials

where we control

against a placebo where one half of the

people get the real treatment and the

other half get placebo but that’s not

enough what I’ve just shown you are

examples of the very simple and

straightforward ways that journalists

and food supplement pill peddlers and

naturopaths can distort evidence for

their own purposes what I find really

fascinating is that the pharmaceutical

industry use exactly the same kinds of

tricks and devices but slightly more

sophisticated versions of them in order

to distort the evidence that they give

to doctors and patients in which we use

to make vitally important decisions so

firstly trials against placebo everybody

thinks they know that a trial should be

a comparison of your new drug against

placebo but actually in a lot of

situations that’s wrong because often we

already have a very good treatment that

is currently available so we don’t want

to know that your alternative new

treatment is better than nothing we want

to know that it’s better than the best

currently available treatment that we

have and yet repeatedly you consistently

see people doing trials still against

placebo and you can get licensed to

bring your drug to market with only data

showing that it’s better than nothing

which is useless for a doctor like me

trying to make a decision but that’s not

the only way that you can rig your data

you can also rig your data by can making

the thing that you compare your new drug

against really rubbish you can give the

competing drug in to lower dose so that

people aren’t properly treated you can

give the competing drug in to higher

dose so that people get side effects and

this is exactly what happened with

anti-psychotic medication for

schizophrenia twenty years ago a new

generation of antipsychotic drugs were

brought in and the promise was that they

would have fewer side-effects so people

set about doing trials of these new

drugs against the old drugs but they

gave the old drugs in ridiculously high

doses twenty milligrams a day of

haloperidol and it’s a foregone

conclusion if you give a drug at that

higher dose that it will have more side

effects and that your new drug will look

better

ten years ago history repeated itself

interestingly when risperidone which was

the first of the new generation

anti-psychotic drugs came off copyright

so anybody could make copies everybody

wanted to show that their drug was

better than risperidone so you see a

bunch of trials comparing new

anti-psychotic drugs against risperidone

at 8 milligrams a day again not an

insane dose not an illegal dose but very

much at the high end of normal until

you’re bound to make your new drug look

better and so it’s no surprise that

overall industry-funded trials are four

times more likely to give a positive

result than independently sponsored

trials but and it’s a big but

it turns out when you look at the

methods used by industry-funded trials

that they’re actually better than

independently sponsored trials and yet

they always managed to get the result

that they want so how does this work how

can we explain this strange phenomenon

well it turns out that what happens is

the negative data goes missing in action

it’s withheld from doctors and patients

and this is the most important aspect of

the whole story it’s at the top of the

pyramid of evidence we need to have all

of the data on a particular treatment to

know whether or not it really is

effective and there are two different

ways that you can spot whether some data

has gone missing in action you can use

statistics or you can use stories I

personally prefer statistics so that’s

what I’m going to do first this is

something called a funnel plot and a

funnel plot is a very clever way of

spotting if small negative trials have

disappeared have gone missing in action

so this is a graph of all of the trials

that have been done on a particular

treatment and as you go up towards the

top of the graph what you see is each

dot is a trial and as you got to the top

those are the bigger chance so they’ve

got less error in them so they’re less

likely to be randomly false positives

randomly false negatives so they will

cluster together the big trials are

closer to the true answer then as you go

further down at the bottom what you can

see is over on this side spurious false

negatives and over on this side the

spurious false positives if there is

publication bias if small negative

trials have gone missing action you can

see it on one of these graphs so you can

see here that the small negative trials

that should be on the bottom left have

disappeared this is a graph

demonstrating the presence of

publication bias in studies of

publication bias and I think that’s the

funniest epidemiology joke that you will

ever hear that’s how you can prove it

statistically but what about stories

well they’re heinous they really are

this is a drug called reboxetine and

this is a drug which I myself have

prescribed to patients and I’m a very

nerdy doctor I hope I go out of my way

to try and read and understand all the

literature I read the trials on this

they were all positive they were all

well conducted I found no flaw

unfortunately it turned out that many of

these trials were withheld in fact 76%

of all of the trials that were done on

this drug were withheld from doctors and

patients now if you think about it if I

toss a coin a hundred times and I’m

allowed to withhold from you the answers

half the times

then I can convince you that I have a

coin with two heads okay

if we remove half of the data we can

never know what the true effect size of

these medicines is and this is not an

isolated story around half of all of the

trial data on antidepressants has been

withheld but it goes way beyond that the

Nordic Cochrane group we’re trying to

get hold of the data on that to bring it

all together the Cochrane groups are an

international nonprofit collaboration

that produce systematic reviews of all

of the data that has ever been shown and

they need to have access to all of the

trial data but the companies withheld

that data from them and so did the

European Medicines Agency for three

years this is a problem that is

currently lacking a solution and to show

how big it goes this is a drug called

Tamiflu which governments around the

world have spent billions and billions

of dollars on and they spend that money

on the promise that this is a drug which

will reduce the rate of complications

with flu we already have the data

showing that it reduces the duration of

your flu by a few hours but I don’t

really care about that governments don’t

care about that I’m very sorry if you

have the flu I know it’s horrible but

we’re not going to spend billions of

dollars trying to reduce the duration of

your flu symptoms by half a day we

prescribe these drugs we stockpile them

for emergencies on the understanding

they will reduce the number of

complications which means pneumonia and

which means death the infectious

diseases Cochrane group which are based

in Italy have been trying to get the

full data in a usable form out of the

drug company so that they can make a

full decision about whether this drug is

effective or not and they’ve not been

able to get that information this is

undoubtedly the single biggest ethical

problem facing medicine today we cannot

make decisions in the absence of all of

the information so it’s a little bit

difficult from there to spin in some

kind of positive conclusion

but I would say this I think that

sunlight is the best disinfectant all of

these things are happening in plain

sight and they’re all protected by a

kind of force field of tediousness and I

think with all of the problems in

science one of the best things that we

can do is to lift up the lid finger

around at the mechanics and peirong

thank you very much

所以我是一名医生,但我有点

溜进了研究领域,现在我是一名

流行病学家,没有人真正

知道流行病学是

什么 最好通过

例子来理解那些疯狂

古怪的报纸头条的科学,这些只是

来自《每日邮报》的一些例子

世界上每个国家都有这样的报纸 它有

这种奇怪的正在进行

的分裂哲学项目

世界上所有的

东西都真的会导致或预防癌症

所以这里有一些他们

说会导致癌症的东西最近离婚了

Wi-Fi 洗漱用品和咖啡这里有

一些他们说可以预防癌症的东西

压碎了红色- 胡椒甘草和

咖啡,所以你已经可以看到这里有

矛盾咖啡既会

导致癌症又能预防癌症,当你开始

阅读时,你会发现也许有

某种 其中一些背后的政治价值

,所以对于女性家务

预防性休息癌症,但对于男性

购物可能会让你阳痿,所以我们

知道我们需要开始揭开

这背后的科学,我希望

表明的是,我正在挑选狡猾的说法

我' 挑选狡猾的说法背后的

证据并不是一种令人讨厌的吹毛求疵的

活动,它对社会有用,但它

也是一种非常有价值的

解释工具,因为真正的科学

就是对证据进行批判性评估,以

支持他人的立场

,这就是学术期刊上发生的事情

这就是发生的事情和学术

会议 博士后提供数据后的问答环节

通常是一场大

屠杀,没有人介意我们

积极欢迎它,这就像一种

同意的智力 S&M 活动,所以

我要向您展示的是所有

主题

我的学科循证医学的所有主要特征

,我会告诉你所有这些,

并展示它们是如何工作

的 只是使用人们

弄错东西的例子,所以我们将从人类已知

的绝对最弱的证据形式开始

,那就是科学权威

不要在乎你的名字后面有多少个字母

我们想

知道你的理由是什么 是因为相信

某事,您怎么知道

某事对我们有利或对我们不利,但我们

也对权威不感兴趣,因为

它很容易设计,这是

一个叫做博士的人。 Gillian McKeith

博士 你能再给她完整的医学头衔

吗 Gillian McKeith 每个国家都有这样的

人 她是我们的电视饮食

大师 她有大量的五

部黄金时段电视节目,提供非常

奢华和异国情调的健康建议 她

原来有一个非

来自美国某个地方的认可函授课程博士

她还吹嘘自己是美国营养顾问协会的

认证专业成员,

这听起来非常迷人

和令人兴奋你获得证书而

这一切都属于我的

死猫海蒂她是一只可怕的猫你

只需去网站填写表格

给他们 60 美元,然后

就可以邮寄了

大量的叶绿素,

这将为你的血液充氧,

任何学过学校生物学的人都

记得叶绿素中的

叶绿素 持续时间只会在阳光下产生氧气

吃完菠菜后肠道会很黑 接下来

我们需要适当的科学

证据 红酒可以帮助预防

乳腺癌 英国《每日

电讯报》的头条新闻 一杯

红酒 day 可以帮助预防乳腺癌,

所以你可以找到这篇论文,你会

发现它是一门真正的科学,

它描述了

当你

从一些红葡萄皮中提取的化学物质

滴到一些癌症上时,一种酶的行为变化 在某处实验室的长凳上的盘子里的细胞,

这是在科学论文中描述的非常有用的东西,

但是

关于如果你喝红酒你自己患乳腺癌的风险的问题,

它告诉你绝对是混蛋——

实际上一切都好 事实证明,你

患乳腺癌的风险实际上会

随着

你喝的每杯酒而略有增加,所以我们想要的是

在真人身上进行研究,

这是另一个例子 来自英国

领先的饮食和营养学家《

每日镜报》,这是我们的第二大

畅销报纸,澳大利亚

2001 年的一项研究发现,橄榄油

与水果蔬菜和豆类相结合

可以有效防止皮肤

起皱,因此

如果你吃橄榄油,他们会给出建议 和蔬菜,

你的皮肤皱纹会更少,它们

非常有帮助地告诉你如何写

纸,所以你去找纸,

你发现的是一项观察性研究,

显然没有人

能够像 1930 年那样回到所有的

人 出生在一个运动单位,其中

一半人吃很多水果、蔬菜

和橄榄油,然后一半人吃

麦当劳,然后我们会看到你有多少

皱纹,你必须

拍下人们现在的情况

你会发现人们当然

会吃水果和蔬菜,而橄榄油

的皮肤皱纹较少,但那是因为

人们吃橄榄油中的水果和蔬菜,

他们是怪胎,好吧,他们是 不

正常 他们和你一样 他们会参加

这样的活动

他们很豪华 他们很富有 他们

不太可能从事户外工作 他们

不太可能从事体力劳动 他们

有更好的社会支持 他们不太

喜欢 吸烟,所以出于一系列

迷人的相互关联的

社会政治和文化原因,他们

不太可能有皮肤皱纹,

这并不意味着它是蔬菜

或橄榄油,

所以理想情况下,你想做的是

试验,每个人都认为他们 非常

熟悉试炼的概念 试炼

很古老 圣经中的第一次试炼

但以理书 1:12 很

简单 你把一群

人分成两半 你以

一种方式对待一个群体 你以另一种方式对待

另一个群体

过了一会儿,你把它们折叠起来,看看

他们每个人发生了什么,所以我

要告诉你一个

试验,这可能是

过去十年英国新闻媒体报道最多的试验。

s 是对

鱼油丸的试验,声称

鱼油丸改善

了主流儿童的学习成绩和行为,

他们说我们已经做过试验,以前所有的

试验都是积极的,我们

知道这会是 - 这

应该永远响起 敲响了警钟,

因为如果您已经知道

试验的答案,那么您不应该

这样做,要么您已经通过设计操纵它,

要么您有足够的数据,

因此无需再随机化人们

,所以这就是他们

在他们的试验中他们要带

3,000 名儿童他们要给

他们所有这些巨大的鱼油丸

,每天 6 个,然后一年后

他们要测量他们的学校考试

成绩,并将他们的考试

成绩与 他们预测,

如果他们没有服用这些药片,他们

的考试成绩会是

这样 s 没有控制 好吧

没有控制 很好,但这听起来

真的很技术对 听起来真的不是

那是一个技术术语,但是孩子们得到

了药丸,然后他们的表现

得到了提高

我们都随着时间的推移而发展,

当然还有安慰剂效应

recibo 效应是整个医学中那些

令人着迷的东西之一,

这不仅仅是关于服用

药丸,你的表现和你的疼痛会

变得更好,

而是关于我们的信念和期望

它是关于 一种

治疗的文化意义,这一点已经

在一系列有趣的研究中得到证明,

将一种安慰剂与另一种安慰剂进行比较,

因此我们知道,例如,每天两片

糖丸比一颗糖丸更能

有效地消除

胃溃疡 一天两片

糖丸胜过一天一粒糖丸

,这是一个令人发指和

荒谬的发现,但这是真的,我们

从三种不同的 研究了所有三种

不同类型的疼痛,盐水

注射比服用糖丸更有效地

治疗疼痛

感觉像是一种

更具戏剧性的干预,所以我们

知道我们的信念和期望可以被

操纵,这就是为什么我们进行试验

,我们

对照安慰剂进行对照,其中一半的

人得到真正的治疗,

另一半得到安慰剂,但这还

不够 我刚才向你们展示的

例子

是记者

和食品补充剂小贩和

自然疗法者可以为了

自己的目的歪曲证据的非常简单和直接的方式我发现真正

令人着迷的是制药

业使用完全相同的

技巧和 设备,但

它们的版本稍微复杂一些,

以歪曲它们提供

给医生和 我们

用来做出至关重要决定的患者,因此

首先针对安慰剂进行试验 每个人都

认为他们知道试验应该

是您的新药与安慰剂的比较,

但实际上在很多

情况下这是错误的,因为通常我们

已经有了很好的治疗 这

是目前可用的,所以我们

不想知道您的替代新

疗法总比没有

好 您可以获得

将您的药物推向市场的许可,而只有数据

表明它总比没有好

通过制作

将您的新药与真正的垃圾进行比较的东西,

您可以

降低竞争药物的剂量,以便

人们 如果治疗不当,您可以

将竞争药物给予更高

剂量,从而使人们产生副作用,

这正是

二十年前精神分裂症

抗精神病药物所发生的情况,新一代抗精神病药物被

引入,承诺是 它们

的副作用会更少,所以人们

开始对这些

新药进行针对旧药的试验,但他们

给旧药服用的剂量高得离谱,

每天 20 毫克

氟哌啶醇,

如果你服用更高剂量的药物,那已成定局

剂量,它会产生更多的

副作用,并且你的新药会看起来

更好

十年前,

新一代

抗精神病药物中的第一个利培酮失去版权时,历史有趣地重演了,

所以任何人都可以复制每个人

都想证明这一点 他们的药物

比利培酮好,所以你看到

一堆试验比较了新

的抗精神病药物和利培酮

的 800 万 每天几克不是

疯狂剂量,不是非法剂量,而是

非常高的正常剂量,直到

你一定要让你的新药看起来

更好,所以毫不奇怪,

整个行业资助的试验有

四倍的可能性

与独立赞助的试验相比,给出了积极的结果

,但这是一个很大的结果,但是

当你查看

行业资助的试验所使用的方法时

,它们实际上比

独立赞助的试验更好,但

他们总是设法得到

他们所需要的结果 想要所以这是如何工作的

我们如何才能很好地解释这种奇怪的

现象事实证明,

负面数据在行动中丢失了

它对医生和患者隐瞒

,这是整个故事中最重要的方面,

它在顶部

证据金字塔 我们需要

拥有特定治疗方法的所有数据,以

了解它是否真的

有效,并且有两种不同的

方法可以发现某些治疗方法是否有效 数据

在行动中丢失了,您可以使用

统计数据,也可以使用

故事 试验

已经消失 已经在行动中消失了,

所以这是对特定治疗进行的所有试验的图表

,当你向上移动

到图表的顶部时,你看到的是每个

点都是一个试验,当你得到 到顶部,

那些是更大的机会,所以他们的

错误更少,所以他们不太

可能随机误报

随机误报,所以他们会

聚集在一起大试验

更接近真实答案,然后你

走得更远 在底部,您可以

看到在这一侧是虚假的假

阴性,而在这一侧是

虚假的假阳性 如果存在

发表偏差 如果小型

阴性试验没有采取行动,您可以

在其中看到它 在这些图表中,您可以

在此处看到应该在左下角的小型阴性试验

已经

消失 这是一张图表,

表明在

发表偏倚研究中存在

发表偏倚,我认为这

是您听过的最有趣的流行病学笑话

这就是你如何从统计学上证明它的方式,

但是故事怎么样,

他们是令人发指的,他们真的

是这种药,叫做瑞波西汀,

这是我自己

给病人开的药,我是一个非常

书呆子的医生,我希望我出去 在我

尝试阅读和理解所有

文献的

方式中

如果你想一想,如果我

抛硬币一百次,我

可以向你隐瞒一半的答案

那么我可以说服你,我有一个

有两个头的硬币,

如果我们删除一半的数据,我们

永远无法知道这些药物的真实效果大小

,这不是一个

孤立的故事,大约有一半的

试验数据 抗抑郁药已被

扣留,但它远远超出了

北欧 Cochrane 小组,我们正

试图掌握这方面的数据,以便将它们

整合在一起 Cochrane 小组是一个

国际非营利性合作组织

,对所有数据进行系统评价

曾经展示过,

他们需要访问所有的

试验数据,但公司隐瞒

了他们的数据,

欧洲药品管理局也是如此,

三年来这是一个

目前缺乏解决方案的问题,并表明

它有多大 这是一种叫做

达菲的药物,

世界各国政府已经花费了数

十亿美元,他们将这笔钱

用于承诺这是一种

可以降低发病率的药物

流感并发症 我们已经有数据

表明它可以将

您的流感持续时间缩短几个小时,但我并不

真正关心政府不

关心这一点 如果您得了流感,我非常抱歉

我知道这是 可怕,但

我们不会花费数十亿

美元试图将

您的流感症状持续时间缩短半天

位于意大利的 Cochrane 集团一直试图

从制药公司以可用的形式获取完整的数据,

以便他们能够就

这种药物是否有效做出全面的决定,

而他们还没有

能够获得这些信息,这

无疑是

当今医学面临的最大的伦理问题,我们无法

在没有所有信息的情况下做出决定,

因此

从 在那里可以

得出某种积极的结论,

但我想说的

是,我认为阳光是最好的消毒剂,所有

这些事情都在眼前发生

,它们都受到

一种乏味力场的保护,我

认为 科学问题

中我们能做的最好的事情之一

就是

在机械师和peirong周围抬起盖子手指

非常感谢你